-= Gametoast.com =-

Topher Kessler wrote:As part of its marketing for OS X, Apple has promoted security of its operating system by making claims to the effect of OS X doesn't get PC viruses -- a stance that has been repeated on its Web site and in various television commercials. While technically true, this claim has been somewhat misleading to consumers who interpret it as there being no malware in any form for OS X. Apple appears to be addressing this confusion with a couple of recent changes to its Web site's rhetoric on security.

Full article

My thoughts? Finally, the annoying, brainwashed ignorance has stopped... Your thoughts?

I wouldn't say stopped, but progress...

With more and more people using Apple products, I actually expect an increase in viruses directed at Macs and iPhones/iPods/iPads. Now, I don't own a Mac, but if the Mac OSX is anything like the iOS in that the actual operating system of the device is locked down tighter than a federal prison, then it will take hackers a lot more work to attack it than attacking a PC, but if the population of Mac users is widespread enough, determination always wins out.

People who are dumb will get viruses on any os. Smart people can get anything they want from any user on any OS so really this is for novice users who keep spreading rumors that apple os is virus free.

I must admit I've had 10000 viruses on 8 of my windows machines and 0 on my Mac airbook any iOS devises. Interesting to read thanks for sharing

Twilight_Warrior wrote:With more and more people using Apple products, I actually expect an increase in viruses directed at Macs and iPhones/iPods/iPads. Now, I don't own a Mac, but if the Mac OSX is anything like the iOS in that the actual operating system of the device is locked down tighter than a federal prison, then it will take hackers a lot more work to attack it than attacking a PC, but if the population of Mac users is widespread enough, determination always wins out.

Actually, there's a guy who used one simple script to exploit several thousand holes in Mac OS X. Heh, he refused to release the information to Apple.

@Guru: np ^^

Marth8880 wrote:Finally, the annoying, brainwashed ignorance has stopped...

Really? All they've done is changed the wording on their website. And despite that, the Apple OSs are still less susceptible for the time being. So I don't see the significance. None of this really makes me want to stop being an "annoying, brainwashed" Mac user.

Moreover, brainwashing, as you put it, or advertising, as everyone else does, is a pretty prevalent thing nowadays. Sure, it's used by Apple. But, (egad!), Microsoft is also prone to making certain claims that need further debunking. That's advertising. The reason the Mac population is growing is because Apple's claims seem more truthful, given that for most consumers, Windows has always seemed more prone to failure, whereas Macs don't usually do that.

I've had no viruses on any computer, never had a Mac.

Grev wrote:

Marth8880 wrote:Finally, the annoying, brainwashed ignorance has stopped...

Really? All they've done is changed the wording on their website. And despite that, the Apple OSs are still less susceptible for the time being. So I don't see the significance. None of this really makes me want to stop being an "annoying, brainwashed" Mac user.

Moreover, brainwashing, as you put it, or advertising, as everyone else does, is a pretty prevalent thing nowadays. Sure, it's used by Apple. But, (egad!), Microsoft is also prone to making certain claims that need further debunking. That's advertising. The reason the Mac population is growing is because Apple's claims seem more truthful, given that for most consumers, Windows has always seemed more prone to failure, whereas Macs don't usually do that.

That's because users can get inside Windows and mess around with its innards (something one should always be able to do), whereas Macs are strictly locked down like Alcatraz. And I wouldn't consider deliberately, directly lying to their customers to be "truthful". Plus, correct me if I'm wrong, Microsoft doesn't really lie about a whole lot; I don't necessarily doubt you, though, and I'd love to see some of these things you're describing.

My largest problem with Apple is that they advertise features in Macs as "brand new" and "innovative" when they have already existed for over a decade. I'll annotate one of their ridiculous "new" feature lists sometime.

Marth8880 wrote: That's because users can get inside Windows and mess around with its innards (something one should always be able to do), whereas Macs are strictly locked down like Alcatraz.

No, actually it has to do with the architecture of the OS. Windows was designed to be a single-user OS, meaning the user had free reign over all of the system. However, the computer can't tell who is doing what on the system, and has no means of enforcing who can do what. As such, virus-ey code can sneak in easily. For a virus to invade your system, it has to install itself, which, since Windows was created with security as an afterthought, can be done easily without you ever knowing. Mac OSX and Linux both use a filesystem that has a strictly-enforced set of permissions attached to each file and folder in the system, which spell out specifically who is allowed to do what. If, in the case of Mac OSX or Ubuntu, you don't have administrative privileges, you simply can't do anything with the files. And that's a good deal of why Mac OSX and Linux are way more secure than Windows -- because viruses simply don't have the authorization to do install themselves behind your back with Mac OSX or Linux. So sure, if you're not the admin, the OS is "locked down like Alcatraz ." But if you do, which is most people who own their Mac, everything is up to you, you just have more control over what's installed or not installed. Therefore = safer.

Marth8880 wrote:Plus, correct me if I'm wrong, Microsoft doesn't really lie about a whole lot; I don't necessarily doubt you, though, and I'd love to see some of these things you're describing.

http://www.msversus.org/microsoft-marketing.html

Enjoy.

I agree. And huh, interesting site... I might just be tired, and I haven't the entire thing, but I can't particularly see what exactly it is that Microsoft's doing wrong (other than the security thing sorta).

For years Windows had the lion's share of the market. That being said there was no advantage to hackers in creating viruses for Mac. They could hit a much larger group by distributing Windows-based malware. There just was no reason to build Mac viruses, though they do exist. I've seen some interesting viruses hit iOS and Android, too.

That being said I'm glad the "Macs are immune" ignorance is slowly going away. Of course they're immune to Windows-based viruses. (and Macs can definitely get em', I cleaned my father-in-law's iMac more than once back in the day) Guess what, Windows users are immune to Android OS viruses. Who would have thought? (not pointing at anyone here, but I've heard the above argument for years)

Grev wrote:http://www.msversus.org/microsoft-marketing.html

I don't know that I'm going to trust a site that takes a one-sided "uncover the evil that is Microsoft" tone. For opinion, that's fine. As a fact that's another thing entirely. They don't even source their information, so who knows where it came from.

The link showed several examples of exactly what you were decrying about Apple - false advertising. I just wanted to correct you so there'd be no more of this:

Marth8880 wrote:

Topher Kessler wrote:Apple appears to be addressing this confusion with a couple of recent changes to its Web site's rhetoric on security.

My thoughts? Finally, the annoying, brainwashed ignorance has stopped...

One attempt to claim Microsoft's software is more secure than a safe was pulled by the Advertising Standards Authority of SA. Microsoft was not capable of proving their software's security by an independant source.

The UK Advertising Standards Authority upheld complaints of a misleading advertisement by Microsoft comparing the cost of [Linux] against Microsoft® Windows™.

Marth8880 wrote:I can't particularly see what exactly it is that Microsoft's doing wrong

Do you see what I'm trying to point out here?

My thoughts?
Well, it doesn't really change anything. Macs still do what Macs do best, and PCs still do what PCs do best.

Speaking of apps n macs I need some app ideas anyone? I know you guys suggested a gt app but never figured what it would be used for, anything else?

An app designed to teach people that wolves aren't jerks who need killing like every movie every tries to tell us? Lol. I try to think of an app each time you ask, but I pretty much draw a blank.

As GT is right now, I don't think an app is needed for it. However if it got hip hoppity popular than an app would be good for keeping up with threads you're interested in.

I see 3 million hits a month in the stats it is funny how that doesn't reflect the 20 or less posts a day.

I just made 2 new apps one for fossils and one for a clients hotel, I'd like to make a game maybe something star warsy but not enough to get sued by Lucas

guru wrote:I see 3 million hits a month in the stats it is funny how that doesn't reflect the 20 or less posts a day.

Well to be fair, Marth and I make up about a million of those hits alone.

I make up another approximate half-million. I'm one of those people that leaves the tab open on the side, and constantly goes back and refreshes the "View Active Topics" button.

Off topic : Heh, I always keep a tab open for View who's online and View new posts myself. ;o

...So, anyway, as for the Mac vs. Windows discussion, I'm speaking as one who doesn't really know what he's talking about , but isn't Vista/7 somewhat more secure than XP? At least, that's the impression I get from all the UAC popups I get.